Are dreams real? Or is the universe false? - Part 2/2

If you have read part 1 and are still here, you probably do not think that this is some 10,000 year old crazy theory that has lasted this long by pure chance. So, in this part 2 of the post, we will take it up a notch and remove all doubts that there are any differences between waking and dreaming.

If you have not read part 1, please do so before continuing below.

 6. Objection: Dream objects and perceptions are often found to be queer and fantastic, the likes of which are not seen in the real world. 

Clarification: Such objects and perceptions, however, absurd, seem perfectly normal to the dreamer. He has his own notion of space, time, shape, distance and form. But his standards are unreal to the waking person. Similarly, the standards of the waking state do not apply in the dream, though both standards have their application in their respective spheres. 

7. Objection: Dream experiences are refuted by waking ones. A man, after waking can judge the merits of the dream but waking experiences are not found to be unreal in dreams, nor does a person sit in judgement, while dreaming, of his waking experiences. Therefore, the two states can not be placed at the same level.

 

Clarification: To the dreamer, the dream is a waking state. In fact, whether a person is awake or dreaming, what passes before him is simply a succession of waking states, one group of real objects coming after another. The special feature of the waking state is that the object perceived in it are felt to be real. When the objects of one waking state are judged in another waking state, and are found to be unreal, the state is called a dream. Thus, it is one waking state which is refuted by another waking state. 

The dream state continually suggests that the waking world, though different, has no higher value than the dream world. That waking objects are no more real than dream objects can be learnt in the waking state itself. In the same waking state, a past experience may be proven false and regarded as a dream. 

A man walking in a dark street in India may see a rope and mistake it to be a snake. In this illusory perception of a snake in a rope, the snake, which was taken to be real is subsequently proved to be a mere idea. And both dreams and past waking experiences are nothing but ideas and memories. The difference between a dream and an illusion is that the former refers to an entire state while the later covers only a part of the state. 

A farmer and his wife were seated by the dead body of their only son. The farmer was in a reflective mood but did not shed a single tear. When his wife reproached him for not showing any emotion, he said that on the previous night, he had dreamt he was a king and he had seven sons endowed with princely qualities. Suddenly he awoke and the children disappeared. Now he is wondering whether he should mourn the loss of his seven children or of the one son lying dead before them.

8. Objection: What gives the indisputable stand of reality to the waking state is that we return to the same objects - such as children, friends, house - each time we awake, whereas we do not see the same objects in successive dream states. 

Clarification: The dream state is a waking state to the dreamer and one knows the state to be a waking state only when there is the feeling that the objects seen are real and remain the same in every successive waking state. This same feeling is present in the dream state while a person is dreaming, otherwise he wouldn't regard the dream as a waking state and the objects seen in it as real. Therefore both states have the characteristics of presenting real and unchanging objects and we have the feeling in both states that the real objects are unchanging. Whether we actually return to the same object in every waking state is a matter of investigation confined to the waking state.

9. Objection: If the objects of the waking state are exactly like those of the dream state, then our beloved kith and kin would be no more than ideas like those of our dream world relatives. Such an attitude is repugnant to our feelings.

Clarification: The relatives seen is waking or dream states are as real as the "I" or the ego, which deals with them. Their physical bodies are also as real as our bodies in those states. Therefore, if a man in the waking state regards his ego or body to be real then his kith and kin should also be regarded as real in that state. It would be wrong to think of one's own body and ego to be real while those of others to be mere ideas.  

10. Objection: The objects in the dream state are mere ideas while in the waking states the real appears real and the unreal, unreal. Further, in the waking state, one has a more clear and logical mind than in the dream state. 

Clarification: A person fully awake can see a snake to be real while on closer investigation, finds it to be only a rope. Till the truth is known, the snake is real to him, though it is only an idea projected by his mind. He sees what his memory produces, if he had never seen a snake before he could have imagined it to be a stick or a crack in the earth. These illusions are common enough to establish the fact that though ideas are subjective and mental, they appear real and objective, being actually perceived by sense organs. Therefore, in both dream and waking states, ideas appear real. 

Objection: These illusions are exceptions and one sees in waking states many realities which are not illusions. 

Clarification: Nothing is more real to a man than his own body. He had a body when he was 6 years old and he has a body now at 60. But the body he had when he was 6 is no longer real and is merely a memory or idea. Is there anything in the world which one takes to be real but is not found to be a memory or idea? 

Objection: The example of the body implies a lapse of time. 

Clarification: The one and the same object appears at the same moment in different forms to different persons and these appearances are real to the person concerned. For example: A man can see a barking dog as vicious and menacing while another man at the same time can see the same dog to be loving and welcoming. What one sees are only forms and ideas.

The implications of these arguments are life changing. Imagine the relief of waking up from a terrible nightmare and realizing it was only a dream. Now imagine the relief you will get, when you realize that all the so-called "real" problems you have ever had and will ever have are just your imagination as well. 

Om Purnamadah Purnamidam Purnat Purnamudacyate |

Purnnasya Purnamadaya Purnamevashissyate ||

Om, that is full. This is full. From that fullness, comes this fullness.

Taking this fullness from that fullness, only fullness remains.

Om Shanti Shanti Shanti ||

Hari Om Tat Sat Sri Ramakrishna Pranamastu ||

Are dreams real? Or is the universe false? - Part 1/2

If we go to the very core of Hinduism, we come across the concept that the world we see around us when we are awake is exactly the same as anything we see in a dream.  There is no difference between the two.

This will sound scandalous to some and philosophical to others. But the arguments given in Vedanta to support this are both logical and practical.

In this 2-part post, I will take you through ten common objections you can have against this when you think of the physical world as real and dreams as a figment of your imagination. Everything below is from the book "The Upanishads Volume 2" by Swami Nikhilananda, first published in 1952. 

1. Objection: Objects perceived in the waking state are real, while those in dreams are not real.

Clarification: Dream objects are felt, while the dream lasts, to be as real as those of the waking state. In dreams there exists a sense of distinction between real and unreal just as in waking state. While dreaming, the sleeping person regards the dream state as the waking state and distinguishes it from other states, otherwise he wouldn't regard the dream experiences as real even for the time being.   

2. Objection: Dreams are subjective - they are creations of sleeper's mind while waking objects are outside, independent of the perceiver and are perceived by sense organs. 

Clarification: What makes this difference is that the sense organs are instruments which are active in the waking state and inactive in sleep. After waking, a man realises that he was dreaming, because he knows that he saw objects in the dream when his sense organs were not functioning. But the sense organs and physical bodies of the dream are as active as those in the waking world. In dreams too, one not only thinks but touches, smells, sees and hears objects though they are only creations of the dream. For example: A man sees a mountain, climbs it and gets satisfaction on reaching the top. Thus there exists not only an ego but also external objects and inner feelings in the dream state as in waking. But the sense organs which appear to be real in one state are found to be unreal in another.

3. Objection: Dream experience is said to be private, its objects and actions being known to the dreamer and no one else while what is seen in the waking experience is shared by others. 

Clarification: The application of private and public to distinguish objects between one state and another is not valid because just like the waking world, the dream world also has other living beings who share with the dreamer the experience of the dream. Dream experience has exactly the same public character while the dream lasts, as waking experience. For example: In a dream, a man can see that he became the king and his wife the queen. In that dream, his wife would be aware of him becoming the king and her the queen and be as happy as him. 

4. Objection: Objects in the waking state last for a significant period of time while those in the dream state last only for minutes.

Clarification: The sense of time is present in both states, each has its independent standard of measurement and the standard of one state, appearing real in that state is proved false in the other. A dream and its dream objects can also be observed to last for months and years, though the dream may not last for more than a few minutes as measured by the standard of time of the waking mind.

5. Objection: Money obtained in dream state can not purchase bread and butter if a person is hungry in the waking state.

Clarification: The opposite is true as well. The money obtained in the waking state can not buy him food in the dream state. If the test of reality is pragmatic, it can be said that dream objects are means to dream ends and waking objects are means to waking ends. Cause effect relationships are present in the dream state and dream mind just as in the waking state and waking mind. But what is considered a logical sequence in the waking state, may not always work in the dream state. Each has its own notion of propriety which is falsified by the other in spite of the belief that each is dealing with reality.

Now, this should give us enough food for thought to chew on for a while. Once you have spent some time thinking this through, please do head over to the second part of the post with the remaining 5 objections.